Sure to stir up some feelings. Please be respectful with your comments.

Even though there has been many attempts to upgrade the area, the properties of Whitehall Place are becoming run down as a whole. Hopefully they will become so run down they are condemned, torn down and single family housing is built in its place. That would be the perfect solution.

The Remlingers could not prove that any of the alleged culprits were refugees....

Just wondering if they've ever tried to get to know the newcomers or if they just complain about someone because they are different.

NE12Ukid- I live on Varner Road, the same street as the Remlingers, refugees have used my property as a cut through. How do I know? They do not speak English. Some, not all, have a blatant disrespect for private property as well as what is handed to them.

I have seen some of their apartments and am appalled of their condition. Many know no better as that is the way they lived in their country of origin. Catholic Charities and the other groups who settle these people in our community need to be held accountable and provide resources to help us as community and school district integrate the refugees into our society instead of compounding the problem by bringing more in.

Ah...I love the smell of racism in the morning. Happy Thanksgiving and hopefully some remember that they wouldn't be here without their ancestors once being ''different" and looking for a better life, too.

Ya, they should take a pie over and introduce themselves. That would probably make them stop urinating on the snack bar and destroying the fields and fences.

NE12Ukid, think about that next time your at a softball game ordering a hotdog.

What's embarrassing is this article and the comments made at Wednesday's council meeting. Shame on us, Whitehall!

I am trying to make my comments without seeming too insensitive as asked ... but, I would tend to believe that the people who reside in Prospect Park may be to blame for the mess of the park(s). When my kids were still at the palace on the hill aka the high school, they (and their friends) would tell us about how the bathrooms were being vandalized by the PP residents aka refugees as well as the other things they did .... they would write on the walls and break things in the classrooms. My kids were bothered by these actions because they respect the fact that we work hard to pay our high taxes to pay for these needed improvements and we waited a long time to have a new clean updated school. And, a lot of the employees in the school did not dare to do anything such as report them or penalize them when witnessing or hearing about these incidents. Wonder why?

So, really, is anyone surprised that they are doing this to the fields?

Thank you Catholic Charities ........ perhaps the bill for cleaning and fixing the park(s) should go to Catholic Charities.

If the refugees are truly the culprits, why not ask Catholic Charities and the Jewish Families and Childrens' Assoc. to contribute to the repair/maintenance of the fields? They may be willing to help out if they are approached as a member of the community since their organizations are bringing people into this area. They probably want to see that the refugees have a place to play and exercise. As far as the Remlingers complaining about alleged refugee trespass on homeowners' property to get to Tillotson school, I would say that is not the Remlinger's business. It is the business of the local property owners to put a stop to it if it is a problem.

I live up two blocks from this area and I have talked to both Whitehall Place and Wallace (Prospect Park). Whitehall Place does not take Section 8 nor are they renting out to refugees though Catholic Charities and other organizations. Wallace Park Section is a different story, they rent to refugees and who you have make complaints to. These refugees come into my yard and pick my trees empty of fruits and take all the vegetables that I have growing in my garden. I had a fence installed around my back yard to keep them but they just climb over it and still invade my property. I have to bring my patio furniture in the house when were not out back as they will try to steal it. Anything that isn't bolted down these refugees feel they have the right to take. Whitehall Borough is stuck in the middle as they can't do much. Making a complaint to Wallace Section is just a waste of time.

Cultural Differences? This country was settled by immigrants who wanted to be Americans. They had different languages,customs and religions too. But they worked to assimilate into America, and all the while adding parts of their cuture in to America. This makes us unique as a nation. And yes, this is still going on. However, there are those who do come here with the idea that their culture is superior to ours, and are willing to exploit our good intentions.

I have been looking for a home in Whitehall or Baldwin since I am from here and want to move home from eastern Pa.. I'll tell you though, I get very little encouragement or good news from friends and family about the direction of these communities. I visit frequently and am very aware of these issues. Those who minimize the destructiveness of these trends to the community and to the value of your homes are making a mistake. The thing i hear the most is "John, be careful. It's not like you remember". And that is the way it is.

It would be interesting to find out if the movers and shakers of Catholic Charities and Jewish Services have these immigrants living next to them. Let me answer that one for you.....Some do-gooders from a church,people who don't even live here,tried to slide a homeless shelter into my neighborhood. We stopped that in it's tracks. Get as many people as you can gather-get petitions-go to EVERY meeting- call/e-mail your council/supervisers,etc. Call the police everytime something happens. You'll get results. These pie in the sky people here on this post would be the first ones screaming if these 'lawful,respectful' immigrants moved next to them. Hypocrites.

20 year resident-Do you own a house? Do you take care of it? Like your neighborhood? Hope your property value never go down ? When immigrants who have no respect,when the homeless who have their own mass of problems-when groups like this move in next to you, DON'T come whining. Let me GUESS who you voted for.

hey bob there is a documentary on Netflix called god grew tired of us...it actually follows these refugees from sadan to prospect park...its a real good watch if u have a chance ...to actually see what these people have survived I'm sure we can find a way to accommodate them..any check it out

I believe it is called external depreciation and it is incurable. Whitehall homeowners are experiencing it right now. Charity and a good attitude toward helping the needy are always appropriate , but there can be more to it than that. Do you know how much this is costing the community in total? That is both official bodies and homeowners. A lot more than you might think I suspect. School taxes, police protection, lost home value. It is legitimate to look at these factors in a way outsiders probably do not. Nevertheless, let's hear some encouraging words.

I watched that film on Netflix. Thanks.

As the Director of the Whitehall Public Library, as well as a volunteer ESL Literacy tutor to many of the area’s refugees, I have the opportunity to witness first-hand the challenges facing the refugees, as well as the various impacts on the local community. I can tell you that the adult students that I work with are hard-working and respectful. Their learning curve is tremendously steep. Many work long hours (at very physical and low-paying jobs) then come home to attend English class during the evening. In addition, they have families to raise and cultural challenges to deal with. I am not at all unsympathetic to the frustrations mentioned above, but these are hard-working, humble individuals that have come from situations that we cannot imagine. For the purposes of effective communication, I suggest that particular concerns be directed towards the various social services in place at Prospect Park. As a literacy tutor we try very hard to develop classroom curriculum that involves ‘real–life’ scenarios and important information. It really does take a village and I’m proud to be playing a small role. My life has been enriched many times over by getting to know my refugee neighbors, many of whom I now call ‘friend’.

I am another resident in the area who lives near the parks. And, my kids attended the school district along with the "refugees". While I feel bad for the lives they were living in the countries from which they fled I am also one who believes that respect should be given to the homeowners and taxpayers who have worked hard for their property and who also pay the HIGH taxes to the school district that these children are attending. The Catholic Charities were the people who brought them over and then just expected everyone else to deal with it. Wrong. When my kids were in the primary schools I always heard how these kids were sent to school without having breakfast and that it was our duty to feed them. What? If they are getting subsidies like welfare and money/food from our tax dollars then why are not getting food in the morning? My question would be if they are getting the money for the food ... have social services check into why mom and/or dad are not FEEDING the children. Let's solve the problem where it begins. And, when the kids were in the high school we were told we should contribute to the families so that they have clothes, cars, etc. Okay, fine. But when I am giving my hard earned money and they are driving a newer nicer car than I am because I save and sacrifice, forget it. Sorry if this does not sit well with some of you ... perhaps you would like a few of these humans who urinate and defecate in yards to visit your yard. I bet you don't!

Another Resident --- absolutely you have a right to complain and so do the others who work hard, pay taxes and have pride in their home (for which they paid), school district and community. My daughter recently graduated from the high school. We originally moved here 20 years ago because we believed the area to be affordable and the school district was good (at that time). Then things changed. Baldwin Whitehall did become the dumping ground for Catholic Charities to place persons from other countries as well as persons from the inner city neighborhoods. This DID have an effect on the townships and borough and a BIG effect on our school district. We basically had to slow our kids down so that the new kids could catch up because they did not have enough, if any, education at all. How fair was that for these kids and our own students. Catholic Charities should have found some way to get these kids caught up before dumping them into our system. How fair was that for these incoming students? My daughter told me about things that went on in the school as well. She talked about how the refugee students and the black students did not get along and that there were different gangs. She told me about the vandalism in the bathrooms. She told me about the fights in the cafeteria. We have property not too far from Prospect Park and I also have had to pick up trash that has been left or thrown in my front yard from groups walking and cutting through.

This is not racist ... this is real. For those of you who do not have to deal with it ... you have no idea. I agree. Let's place some of these families in Mt. Lebanon, Uppity St. Clair, Peters, etc. See how long they put up with this in their protected neighborhoods and districts.

Shame on Catholic Charities. They need to take care of what they start.

Your vodka is Russian. Your pizza is Italian. Your kebab is Turkish. Your democracy is Greek. Your coffee is Brazilian. Your tea is Sri Lankan. Your shirt is Indian. Your oil is Saudi Arabian. You car is Japanese. Your electronics are Chinese. Your numbers Arabic, your letters Latin. And you complain that your neighbour is an immigrant?
Lets try to learn good things from them and teach them good stuff and make a better community!

bd
12:06 pm on Sunday, November 25, 2012
If Whitehall Place is as dilapidated as you say (and I have no reason to doubt that) , then demand that Whitehall Council send the Code Enforcement Officer there to law down the law. Do inspections, charge the owners for repeat violations and get this property up to code requirements.....

FF19
12:14 am on Thursday, November 22, 2012 Even though there has been many attempts to upgrade the area, the properties of Whitehall Place are becoming run down as a whole. Hopefully they will become so run down they are condemned, torn down and single family housing is built in its place. That would be the perfect solution.

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Sure, it's a solution, if you have the money. bd's suggestion just sounds more do-able.
I still just wonder how many NEIGHBORS have extended a helping hand is all.

This is just a case of vandalism. A stronger police presence or a security force by the owners of Whitehall Place is the only thing that will stop it.
As far as private property around the fields...protect your own property!!!

Another view: http://baldwin-whitehall.patch.com/articles/watch-refugees-enjoy-thanksgiving-at-whitehall-church#youtube_video-12344319

tHANKS, Patch!

Beautiful video that captures the real meaning of Thanksgiving. Community and gratitude. In the ESL class that I tutor in Prospect Park we spent a good deal of time communicating the history behind the original Thanksgiving; learning about how the Native Americans taught the Pilgrims how to best survive in their new country. Centuries later the message remains--this made my day.

20 Yr Resident--That is a good reminder for us all. Refugees are not the same as immigrants. They come from war torn countries, from famine, from a struggle many of us in America (God willing) will never know. Many have lost not only their native land and life as they know it, but family members, loved ones, their homes, and so on. Often, they come not knowing English. I don't know whether they vandalize, but residents of the area have a unique opportunity to offer friendship to these individuals. Perhaps if they had felt more at home in their new land, they would treat it respectfully! Maybe try helping these people, what does complaining solve??

I just wanted to put my two cents in to this conversation. I believe that refugees are immigrants .. they are coming to this country for whatever reasons to live in this country. It is horrible that they have had to see their countries involved in senseless wars and see their friends and family members hurt and/or killed. Yes, many of them, if not ALL of them come here not knowing any English. That is unfair to them absolutely.

I know that people in the communities of Baldwin and Whitehall have welcomed them. Residents have donated food, clothing, etc. to help these families. I can remember getting notes from the different schools in the district talking about food drives and clothing drives for the needy refugees. We contributed gladly. I also know that some (not all) of the teens (refugees) attending the high school showed very little respect for the new building and destroyed fixtures in it. Why? Does this make them feel at home>? I believe they have been shown friendship and caring. So you are saying that WE need to do more for them to do what they should be doing ... treating what they have been given from the kindness and generosity of our residents to treat OUR property with respect?

Please .... we ALL have been helping these people. We have helped with food, clothing, housing, friendship, etc. It is time they show us that they appreciate what we GIVE them.

And when someone pees or defecates on my property I WILL COMPLAIN.

Nice that you have done something to help, and not nice that some teens have destroyed property or acted inappropriately. Certainly that is wrong, whether it is refugee teens or our own born and bred in America teens.
But as you say, it's SOME, not all of these teens---in either group.

I sympathize with all of you who have had your property destroyed. (I get upset when someone carelessly throws a candy wrapper onto my lawn--and that's just a candy wrapper!) Our home means a lot to us; it is our pride, and it is exasperating when other people don't respect our space. I think everyone would agree that no one would want his/her property vandalized. To say otherwise would risk being untrue.

I think it was wrong of the author of this article to start off with "Like it or not..." That left a bad taste in my mouth from the beginning. Why wouldn't we like it that our community is home to refugees? To imply that we might not makes us sound like haters, that we are not open to helping others. What we hate and what we are not open to is destruction to our community.

Maybe we could use our words with more care. Maybe we can accept that some refugees (and not all) and also some U.S. citizens vandalize and trespass. I can't imagine the words "those refugees" are spoken without a negative tone when we speak them at the dinner table or with friends or with family. I would hate that our frustration at seeing our lawns being peed on makes us appear racist...because when we speak in a certain way about a group of people, it does.

observer
11:55 am on Monday, December 3, 2012
I sympathize with all of you who have had your property destroyed.
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Of course, but you should have seen the attacks on those who formerly complained on Patch about their property being destroyed by cats owned by people who let them run free and cause such damage.
At least we can work to better communicate with and teach our new neighbors; talking to those cat people is impossible!